Outrageous bonus disc ideas

Post by **markus** » 15 Jan 2006 13:40

I'm beginning to dream of the bonus disc project in my sleep. Some outrageous(?) ideas:

- 22 bit re-mastering. A few years ago Wagram France re-issued a few 808 State CDs with 22 bit digital remastering. See picture below. Since I don't own and haven't got the right equipment anyway, I can't compare. Anyone? Anyway, obviously it would be nice to the re-issues to be re-mastered. Don't think this is too outrageous as it's obviously been done before.

- Box set with State2State3? It occured to me that people buying all six CDs should receive them in a boxset. The box could include a bonus disc (State To State Volume 3) with all the stuff included that doesn't make it onto the individual bonus discs. Pretty outrageous I know, but ZTT did the bonus disc thing with Optibuk and New Order with Retro. The box production wouldn't have to bee too expensive for ZTT and it would be a nice reward for people shelling out on six albums. Could be a highly limited edition, e.g. only 100. Numbered individually, OK I'm getting carried away now.

- Tracks merged into eachother? 808 have always made a point of mixing tracks into eachother on their albums, it is characteristic for their albums. It's been suggested to publish them with breaks. I disagree, I'm even going so far as to suggest that the break that originally happened on CD, because vinyl was propably still king (Ninety), is replaced with merging. In Ninety's case that would be between Pacific and Donkey Doctor. So the options are: Break them up, merge them all (making the re-issues more collectible and a finger to people trying to create mp3s), or leave it like it was. Let's have a heated debate!

Post by **nickking** » 15 Jan 2006 14:06

Yes, the only French CD that I've managed to track down so far is "90" - tried ordering the others via Amazon France, only to be told that they've been deleted... Also, FNAC don't seem to list them anymore - I do wish that I'd purchased them all when I had the chance...

(They were issued around 1999, btw, on ZTT/Wagram).

As for whether it sounds different, it's difficult to say, as I don't have a high-end stereo to fully take in the differences. I would say that it sounds slightly better than my UK/US versions of 90 (in terms of sound quality), but as to how much?

Anyway, remastering to 22-bit does take time, and is probably very expensive - okay, it's already been done for the actual albums (for France - if the tapes are still available?), but we do have to remember that the bonus tracks would also need to have a similar process undertaken...

Yeah, a box set would be nice, with any tracks left over on a seperate CD, but that'll probably remain a dream, as it's probably too expensive for ZTT to finance that (I'm guessing, anyway - especially as royalties/etc would need to be paid to the relevant parties - not just ex-members of 808, but also of samples/etc included in the songs, as well as the cost of mastering/pressing the CD's)...

We can, but dream, though!

As for tracks mixed together, yeah I like that idea - okay, it doesn't make ripping the particular tracks to an iPOD/computer/etc that easy - a lot of people nowadays don't listen to albums from start to finish, and instead cherry-pick their best tracks - something that's more difficult to do, if they're merged together. I'd still prefer (from a personal point of view) to listen to the albums as originally intended - and that includes whether they're merged or not!

BADGERMAN · Post by **BADGERMAN** » 15 Jan 2006 16:57

Could have an extra bonus of a live CD. If a quality recording exsists of the vigo set - wouldnt that make a fantastic disk? I think so - each track sounds fantastic and great live.

Although I do like the idea of state to state vol3!

Rodders · Post by **Rodders** » 15 Jan 2006 19:44

22 bit remastering - can somebody enlighten me here - as far as i'm aware all normal audio CD's are 16 bit 44.1 Khz, and music done at a higher bit rate (i believe 24 is the norm) is dithered down to 16 bit when mastered. does the 22 bit remastered version mean the original (presumably 16 bit) sessions are remastered at 22 bit and then dithered back down again to 16 bit? what real difference does this make to the audio quality?

box set - smashing idea, and i like the idea of it being a live album even better. it would be a great way to say thanks to the true fans (i.e. all the ones fighting over the track listings!

, as we're the ones likely to buy it, us and ZTT completists. either way if the box set thing does happen, how possible would it be to buy signed copies via the website (like kevin smith does with all his DVD's) ??

track merging - i'm with nick here, leave them as originally intended, if it's merged it's merged. if merging is considered as a way of "giving the finger to people trying to create MP3s", i would give the finger back by not buying any of them and downloading the lot. i own an mp3 player, why would you want to make it difficult for me to listen to the albums on it?

Post by **markus** » 15 Jan 2006 21:15

95 % is merged... I just meant it as a finger to all the bootleggers really.

Rodders · Post by **Rodders** » 15 Jan 2006 21:25

ah. that's alright then

"down with this sort of thing!"

Mark · Post by **Mark** » 16 Jan 2006 00:02

Blimey! A box set with State To State 3 included? That would indeed be 808 heaven, although as Nick states finance may be a problem.

PeteZarustica · Post by **PeteZarustica** » 16 Jan 2006 00:56

22 bit remastering - can somebody enlighten me here

That's right, it's confusing. But there it goes; when you're talking about 22bit remastering your talking about digital conversion. The better it is the better it will sound in comparision to lower bitrate coversions - even when the final media is only 16 bit.

It's like scanning an image with a high end scanner - even if it's downsized to 72 dpi (screen resolution) for the internet, let's say... it will still look better and more faithful to the original than scanning it with your 50£ scanner

That is... if I'm not wrong

PeteZarustica · Post by **PeteZarustica** » 16 Jan 2006 01:01

track merging - i'm with nick here, leave them as originally intended, if it's merged it's merged. if merging is considered as a way of "giving the finger to people trying to create MP3s", i would give the finger back by not buying any of them and downloading the lot. i own an mp3 player, why would you want to make it difficult for me to listen to the albums on it?

I don't like the whole idea of merging, sorry. I like to have the separate track to build my own playlists, to be able to play it @ night, mixing it with another track etc... If the original is merged, let's keep it that way... if it isn't, well that's not gonna stop piracy - people are already sharing full lossless wav files!!!

PeteZarustica · Post by **PeteZarustica** » 16 Jan 2006 01:05

And I add, what WILL stop piracy - or at least sell enough copies so piracy isn't a problem - is a GOOD publicity of the boxset (i'm dreaming of it)/re-issues. Please folks @ ZTT, please put half the effort Graham is putting to compile these tracks and let's make it a phenomena. It only depends on GOOD publicity because the material is awesome, the history is there, the respect is enormous, so what we need here is to people to KNOW they're gonna be out and how precious and important those records are. Send a press release with a promo to each and every music press in UK, USA and France/Germany and let everybody knows what gold really is.

BADGERMAN · Post by **BADGERMAN** » 24 Jan 2006 10:49

I got to admit I prefere seperate tracks to build up my own playlist, although it might affect the way the albums sound - We have got the old releases if we need a merged album. It is only going to affect the way that newbies percieve the albums and as long as the tracks on the albums are great (which they are!) then it shouldnt be a problem.

It would be good to involve us fans in a competition like we had with Outpost. Name the track - if there are any unheard of tracks needing a name, or perhaps name of the mix of a track if remixed. Im sure Soulflex was very proud. To win perhaps a studio CDR or something, artwork, signed demos etc etc.....